school shootings

bassjones · Post by **bassjones** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 8:44 am

Serious question here... What is behind all these school shootings? What societal issues in other words.

this dude · Post by **this dude** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 9:01 am

Sociopathy fostered in humiliation/rejection/being bullied.

WBOB · Post by **WBOB** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 9:11 am

needing attention, lack of parenting, playing copycat.

Al Quandt · Post by **Al Quandt** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 9:19 am

this dude wrote:Sociopathy fostered in humiliation/rejection/being bullied.

without a doubt. that sh*t ruins you.

this dude · Post by **this dude** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 9:35 am

Teaches hate to an otherwise (usually) bright outgoing kid. Throw in lack of parental concern/attention, puberty hang-ups, whatever...

sharkmansix · Post by **sharkmansix** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 9:47 am

I think it's America has an interesting duality about violence.

On one hand we celebrate the culture of the warrior. We encourage the iconization of people who use violence to accomplish their means. Look at our popular heros and 9 times out of 10 they will 'shoot first and ask questions later'.

Then we are disgusted when kids (and adults, lately it's been adults doing the shooting) turn to violence to accomplish some sick goal.

The easy way to 'take the power back' is through violence and there is no more of a useful took then a gun to do that.

I also agree with the lack of parenting and social / emotional abuse as contributing factors. I f'ing hate it though when they blame video games and music. It's a cop-out. It's so easy to just blame the item the kids are turning to when they have almost no parential interaction.

Oliver's Army · Post by **Oliver's Army** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 9:52 am

Snack foods, specifically Twinkies

bassjones · Post by **bassjones** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 10:08 am

sharkmansix wrote:I think it's America has an interesting duality about violence.

On one hand we celebrate the culture of the warrior. We encourage the iconization of people who use violence to accomplish their means. Look at our popular heros and 9 times out of 10 they will 'shoot first and ask questions later'.

Then we are disgusted when kids (and adults, lately it's been adults doing the shooting) turn to violence to accomplish some sick goal.

The easy way to 'take the power back' is through violence and there is no more of a useful took then a gun to do that.

I also agree with the lack of parenting and social / emotional abuse as contributing factors. I f'ing hate it though when they blame video games and music. It's a cop-out. It's so easy to just blame the item the kids are turning to when they have almost no parential interaction.

I can agree with that. But we've always celebrated the warrior and this is a relatively new phenomena. Also, you seem to contradict yourself in that you say we celebrate the "shoot first, ask questions later" action hero, but don't think violent video games and music lyrics contribute... Screen heroes do, but video games and music lyrics don't???

Of course popular media influences people. Why else would companies spend 4 million dollars for a 30 second commercial during the Super Bowl?

sharkmansix · Post by **sharkmansix** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 10:22 am

But we've always celebrated the warrior and this is a relatively new phenomena.

Not quite. Wiki shows the first school massacre occuring in 1927.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_shootings

However the media didn't report it back then.

but don't think violent video games and music lyrics contribute... Screen heroes do, but video games and music lyrics don't???

I'm not blaming the heros either I just find it interesting that we celerbate the culture of the warrior but are confused when violence erupts. If we celebrated the pacifist monks in Tibet maybe things would be different.

If you read what I wrote I said that kids turn to TV and video games because of a lack of parental interaction. That's where I lay the blame, the parents.

Almost everyone I know plays violent video games, listens to some form of extreme music, and enjoys bloodshed in their movies. Also most of my friends were not the popular kids in school. Most (of not all) of us were teased, bullied, etc in some fashion. Yet none of them (us) have gone to such extremes. Media can not be the main factor.

Of course popular media influences people. Why else would companies spend 4 million dollars for a 30 second commercial during the Super Bowl?

Because they think it will get people to buy their product. Advertising works to some extent.

I caught this quote on Glen Beck the other night; which is funny because it was in-between 2 commercial breaks.

bassjones · Post by **bassjones** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 10:34 am

Now, I get what you were saying. I blame the parents too - usually anyway. Allot of the kids involved are on some sort of anti-depressants or behavior controlling medication as well and I think that plays a big part, far bigger than we realize I believe. Those drugs mess with kids minds. They dull their emotional centers. When you don't feel any emotion it becomes far easier to commit such horrific crimes.

sharkmansix · Post by **sharkmansix** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 10:34 am

BTW, I too am guilty of celebrating the warrior. Look at my sig and avatar.

WBOB · Post by **WBOB** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 10:36 am

Almost everyone I know plays violent video games, listens to some form of extreme music, and enjoys bloodshed in their movies.

...and don't forget those of us brought up on the "violent"
Looney Tunes cartoons while eating your cereal on
a Saturday Morning.

caught this quote on Glen Beck the other night

Love his show. Veerry entertaining from an everyman's POV.

sharkmansix · Post by **sharkmansix** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 10:41 am

Love his show. Veerry entertaining from an everyman's POV.

I'm not a fan.

Al Quandt · Post by **Al Quandt** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 10:47 am

Though I as an Adult dont mind violent video games, and if they were out when I was a kid I would have loved them too (well I did have Doom back then).

But as an adult and father now, I would be very picky on what video games my kids play. Music is much different though, yes there is some music I probably wouldn't let my daughter listen to because of content (ie. Brit Spears, Jessica Simpson ...exc).

But music has a much better effect on a lonely/picked on kid. It is most times more intelligent and educational, then say, maybe coming home from school and popping in GTA and shooting and running over people.

The music of my generation saved my life as a kid growing up as the most picked on kid in school. This music was anything from Pearl jam to Manson. It never made me want to kill my neighbors or classmates, it made me want to be a musician and write lyrics like these people.

Then studying these people made me interested in the extracurricular activities that they participated in (religion, protests, charities..exc).

Though I wanted some people dead in my school metaphorically ( really just didnt want to be around them ) I would have never picked up a gun.

I stuck it out, and found as an adult that my dorky ass is on my way to success and many of the folks that made fun of me are at a dead end in life and will never move on.

G Fresh · Post by **G Fresh** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:14 am

I mostly agree with what everyone's written so far about the lack of parenting/society/etc., but I'd like to interject something else as well. With the advent of the internet and the 24 hour news cycle you hear about this kind of stuff more often. While I agree that society as a whole is on a downturn I wonder if its as bad as they say or if its just being reported more often, thus artificially inflating the danger and distress we all feel.

Case in point (and appropriate to the season) Trick or Treating used to be something where kids could go out by themselves, fill up there bags with all kinds of goodies and then scarf it all down until they made themselves sick. Nowadays out of fear of poison and razor blades (widely reported as being a real threat) and child molesters, kids have to be accompanied by their parents and all there candy has to be X-rayed before they are allowed to eat any of it. The danger of child molesters notwithstanding, poisoned candy and apples with razor blades in them is widely believed to be a problem bordering on an epidemic which is not the case at all. Read this article to see what I mean...http://www.snopes.com/horrors/poison/halloween.asp

So yeah, what part does the constant news media barrage of everything negative (if it bleeds it leads) play in our perception of how "bad" everything is?