More Kids, More Tax?

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bwohlgemuth
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Post by bwohlgemuth »

But what about the economic strain on finite resources? Our money is imaginary. It's no longer based on any real assets. The more the population grows, the more strain that each individual will feel until collapse.
Sorry, but this is a load of crap.

Remember twenty years ago when pundits were calling for "gloom and doom" when we hit six billion? Didn't happen. Why? Because our technology kept up with our growing base of consumers. Supply and demand.

And money based on reality? Please..... People keep bitching on how money is worthless because it is based on a floating standard and the only "real money" is in gold. Well, what is gold but a pretty metal? It only has value because we put value upon it. Imagine how valuable penicillin would have been during the bubonic plague? Probably more valuable than gold...
No... just strictly statistically speaking, part of the reason for the percentage changes in the racial makeup of the US is that caucasians are not having children at the same rate as other racial groups. In fact, we're dangerously close to dying at a faster rate than we're reproducing.
And this will change too....once a western culture & lifestyle is adapted to the world as a whole. Once a family can stop working to just survive (where food, water, medicine, and shelter are plentifu), then we will start to see the ideals of the underdeveloped world to melt away.
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Post by deek »

I say screw welfare and government assistance...it hurts everyone!
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Post by Krieves »

A value added tax might not be a bad thing. Don't tax me on what I make. Tax me on what I spend. Encourage me to earn and save/invest money. If I want a huge Hummer H1, tax me on it. If I want to take that same money and put in it in my IRA, dont't.

Just my 0.02 cents worth.
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Post by bwohlgemuth »

A value added tax might not be a bad thing. Don't tax me on what I make. Tax me on what I spend. Encourage me to earn and save/invest money. If I want a huge Hummer H1, tax me on it. If I want to take that same money and put in it in my IRA, dont't.
The scary thing is, that will most likely reduce growth, for a while at least. Not a depression, but at least a recession while that is implemented. People spending less is a bad thing for the economy. Just ask China, where the government is starting to panic because the middle class spends very very little of their meager income.
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Post by cwallace »

Oliver's Army wrote:We cant/wont have children, ever.

Do I get a tax break since my dollars are going a school system that is not being used by my "family"?

I never needed welfare.

I dont want to pay for that either.

What else do my taxes go to that I never get to take advantage?
I agree there totally...now I have one kid and one on the way and I feel it reasonable to pay my fair share, but how about the MANY tax dollars I paid BEFORE there was a kid in my life...

How about FLAT SALES TAX?? Get rid of the income tax altogether and raise the sales tax...as was mentioned...the more kids the more spending...so in fairness you would be paying your due...

Chris
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Post by Garr »

bwohlgemuth wrote:Sorry, but this is a load of crap.
Then explain to me why the majority of China live well below the poverty line? The fact that we have finite resources cannot be refuted or disputed. There is only so much to go around. Tech advances will not keep up with it forever.

It's attitudes like that which further perpetuate the downward spiral. Economically, an equilibrium must be met and if the population continues to expand, that will never happen.

Money, worth, value, are ALL imaginary. They are man-made concepts with no truly tangible quality. Money is imaginary. It only has the value that people allow it to have. That currency is based on both tangible and intangible, but there are limits to it nonetheless. There are reasons why the candy bar my mom paid $0.05 for as a child now costs me at least $0.75 and it all has to do with imagined, arbitrary, and ambiguous worth.
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Post by Sankofa »

bassjones wrote:On the other hand, I would be highly supportive of forced Norplant for women whose current children are on ANY form of public assistance. If that doesn't work, then force her to have her tubes tied. Oh, and a forced vasectomy for men whose children are likewise a financial burden to the people.
1984
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Post by Sankofa »

bassjones wrote:Of course, in this country it's essentially those of us who are of a european heritage that are unbreeding ourselves into extinction...
Why does that matter?
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Post by bwohlgemuth »

Garr wrote:Then explain to me why the majority of China live well below the poverty line? The fact that we have finite resources cannot be refuted or disputed. There is only so much to go around. Tech advances will not keep up with it forever.
Actually, I think you are missing my point. Resources are finite, however, the amount that is out there is well within our means to generate and to consume it. The planet is an amazing recycling machine, take a steaming pile of crap and six months later with the right conditions....tacos, anyone?

Here's what I mean. As I said before, twenty years ago pundits were dooming & glooming the world with overpopulation fears. And at the time, they were right. If the third world continued to use farming techniques circa 1200BC, they would starve and die.

Humanity has been able to find new ways to generate the same or better products with less waste. This has been true in farming (manual labor vs. machinery), water purification (boiling/superclorination vs. reverse osmosis), and in industgry (steam/hydralic power vs. electrical). We are now in the middle of a rapid growth in technology. Sure, we could do something realy bad (a.k.a. Skynet), but there's nothing to stop that from happening, except introducing an arbitrary limit on innovation, which would only postpone the inevitable and probably kill millions in the process by denying them the technology they need to pull their countries out of poverty.

And China is stuck in the poverty line because the communist government did a wonderful job of removing wealth from the masses, all in the name of being "fair"
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Post by bassjones »

Sankofa wrote:
bassjones wrote:On the other hand, I would be highly supportive of forced Norplant for women whose current children are on ANY form of public assistance. If that doesn't work, then force her to have her tubes tied. Oh, and a forced vasectomy for men whose children are likewise a financial burden to the people.
1984
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Post by bassjones »

Sankofa wrote:
bassjones wrote:Of course, in this country it's essentially those of us who are of a european heritage that are unbreeding ourselves into extinction...
Why does that matter?
Explained in later post. Doesn't really matter, just an observation...
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Post by Morphine Child »

bassjones wrote:
On the other hand, I would be highly supportive of forced Norplant for women whose current children are on ANY form of public assistance. If that doesn't work, then force her to have her tubes tied. Oh, and a forced vasectomy for men whose children are likewise a financial burden to the people.
So is this a brand of Libertarian Communism that I'm not aware of? :)
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Post by bassjones »

I wasn't being serious about that... Where's that dang sarcasm button again? I do think we need to do something about the welfare lifers, but to be honest that's a pretty rare thing. Most people receive assistance for a while and then end up doing well. Generational poverty is an entirely different thing and I don't think there are any easy fixes, but preventing the 14-year-old children of 28-year-old women, and 45-year-old grandmothers who have all been on public assistance since they were babies is one important step in making sure they break the cycle of generational poverty.
"brad!
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